6Mile Production Link with Rocket + 25dBi Grid's

[UBNT-Mike.Ford]

Hey Guys,

I said I would grab you pics of one of our Live links. This link is 6 Miles in the heart of the silicon valley (North San Jose) We are shooting over the top of the Cisco complex (we can see 40+ 5ghz AP's)

Signal Strength: AMQ is 58% 200Mbps/200mbps data rates / - 68 to -71 - Noise floor is - 90 - 5745, 40Mhz channel

Screens with AirMax off -

http://www.ubnt.com/downloads/airmax-disable-6mile.jpg

Screens with AirMax on -

http://www.ubnt.com/downloads/airmax-enable-6mile.jpg

[doush]

I would like to see PtMP tests with Airmax enabled if you do have such a testing environment.

[FlemmingFrandsen]

Hmm, this says max bandwidth was 89 Mb/s, how did you get the 100 Mb/s number from the marketing material?

[UBNT-Mike.Ford]

Hmm, this says max bandwidth was 89 Mb/s, how did you get the 100 Mb/s number from the marketing material?


This is a link under extremely high noise and is NOT Bullet M5. Please read the setup.

100Mb is for a clean enviroment using Bullet M5's.

Thanks,

Mike

[agsweeney]

This is a link under extremely high noise and is NOT Bullet M5. Please read the setup.

100Mb is for a clean enviroment using Bullet M5's.

Thanks,

Mike

Albeit that there are some bugs getting worked out of these products right now, I will chime in here and let you know that a Bullet5M is more than capable of 100Mbps. I have seen my numbers peaking in the 120Mbps+ range on a 4.8 mile PTP link (FTP w/10 threads running).

Typical speeds on this link are in the mid to high 90's.......

PowerStation5's claim to be capable of 50Mbps???? Well, that is another animal.

[kijoma]

hi,

the PS5 claim was one made in error i reckon. it uses same CPU as the nano's as far as i am aware so ~30Mbps TCP turbo is about it.

[davey]

I would like to see PtMP tests with Airmax enabled if you do have such a testing environment.

Yeah, me too. I can't wait to see PtMP tests as this is where Airmax should shine. I am currently building a few new towns using RB411AH/XR5 stuff but would love to use the Airmax stuff. I think it would be prudent to wait to see performance and for firmware to mature. Pretty excited about it all though.

[masked]

When you say Rocket + Grids, are you talking two seperate gridpack antennas on each end, using 2x2 chains? or 1x1 w/ 40Mhz?

[UBNT-Mike.Ford]

When you say Rocket + Grids, are you talking two seperate gridpack antennas on each end, using 2x2 chains? or 1x1 w/ 40Mhz?


Dual Pol 25dBi, 2x2, 40Mhz.

Thanks,

Mike

[Wifi442]

Dual Pol 25dBi, 2x2, 40Mhz.

Thanks,

Mike

Cool deal. When will we be seeing these new grids? The 30db dish is cool but a 25db Dual Pol grid sounds like it would be a lot smaller and more wind friendly for shorter links where two nano m's wouldn't cut it :)

[Headbang]

I have seen repeatedly with every link using PS5's and Nano5's 44Mbps TCP using Turbo/fast frame/WPA2 AES singnals normaly around -60~-65

Tested with FTP file transfer

[spainuser]

Mike what power have you used??


For 6 milles and 25 dbi antenna, -71 dbm RX signal is very low (I must be -60 dbm RX signal with 23 dbi gain and 20 dbm TX power).

Thanks,

Juan

[derdrack]

Cool deal. When will we be seeing these new grids? The 30db dish is cool but a 25db Dual Pol grid sounds like it would be a lot smaller and more wind friendly for shorter links where two nano m's wouldn't cut it :)

Hi Mike. I was just trying to get my head arround the M series and wondering about PtP and thinking the dish was large for the short PtP's I want to make.

Hopefully learn best options at the Madrid Conference.

[UBNT-Mike.Ford]

Mike what power have you used??


For 6 milles and 25 dbi antenna, -71 dbm RX signal is very low (I must be -60 dbm RX signal with 23 dbi gain and 20 dbm TX power).

Thanks,

Juan

Our noise floor is extremely high.

Thanks,

[tcook]

Dual Pol 25dBi, 2x2, 40Mhz.

Thanks,

Mike

Are these grids a soon to be product or off the shelf, I have an application I could use these.

[Dave-D]

Sorry, those weren't grids--they were panels.
Available off-the-shelf at your distributor. Dave

[UBNT-Mike.Ford]

Sorry, those weren't grids--they were panels.
Available off-the-shelf at your distributor. Dave


This is correct, sorry for the type.

Mike

[Sirhc]

I have several AP's set up using 16 db 120 Deg sectors with up to 20 clients. I am using 20 mhz channel width with airmax turned off. I see very consistently 45 mbs in one way single copy test and 25+ in both direction with dual copy to and from. Pings remain below 20 ms under heavy load. Also the copy test could be hindered as 45 mbs is the maximum I can pull from my head office as each tower is currently fed by dual Proxim 5.3 CX-1 links using cisco OSPF so no one stream can exceed 45 mbs in one direction.

Also links up to 2 miles to NM5 clients. Have been impressed with stable links as low as -78 db. Of course I did not leave production links in place with less then -72 db though.

Also impressed on a few short shots just under a mile with no line of sight at all (tree growth) preforming stable until we were able to come out with bucket truck and do some pruning.

We now offer a $49 program that blows Comcast away. We give 3 mbs up and down with a 10 second power boost that allows up to 20 mbs.

Comcast in this area allows 16 mbs burst for 1st 10 mega byte of transfer then drops to 2 mbs. UBIQUITI WINS:icon_wink:

I was hoping to drop most of my 2.4 links to customers due to noise and use Rocket M2 with 30 db dish as my back hauls but i just learned they are not making 2.4 dish stems:icon_cry:

My Proxim 5.3 CX-1 links are old and failing and EOL so as they fail they are gone. Considering Dragon Licensed equipment for back hauls but at 12K per link I am hoping for a Ubiquiti miracle. Maybe even something in the 3.65????

We currently have 90 mbs at each tower with in beginning to be lacking with this MIMO equipment.

We get our fiber feed from Level 3 which is currently 100mbs but I can increase it to oc-12 levels. It is also on a fiber sonet so its very reliable. I love Level 3.

Anyway we also run a large cache server which is running at around 20% hit ratio.

[kabelfrei]

Sorry, those weren't grids--they were panels.
Available off-the-shelf at your distributor. Dave

What antennas you are using. Mars dualpol 25dBi? We are searching for good Panel antennas with 23dBi and 25dBi for Links >3km.

thanks and with best regards,

kabelfrei

[spirited]

Sirhc what are you using to throttle the burst?
Kabelfrei, I second that question....

[Sirhc]

Sirhc what are you using to throttle the burst?
Kabelfrei, I second that question....

www.etinc.com

BWMGR

[WISPNZ]

Hey Guys,

I said I would grab you pics of one of our Live links. This link is 6 Miles in the heart of the silicon valley (North San Jose) We are shooting over the top of the Cisco complex (we can see 40+ 5ghz AP's)

Signal Strength: AMQ is 58% 200Mbps/200mbps data rates / - 68 to -71 - Noise floor is - 90 - 5745, 40Mhz channel

Screens with AirMax off -

http://www.ubnt.com/downloads/airmax-disable-6mile.jpg

Screens with AirMax on -

http://www.ubnt.com/downloads/airmax-enable-6mile.jpg


Greetings Mike!

A bit of a delayed question :D

Were those results 89mbit/s full-duplex or half-duplex?

Are the rockets 300/300 units? So if they could get a rate of 270/270 it would be running at +- 135mbit/s full-duplex?

Thanks for the time!

Arno

[WISPNZ]

Any update to my questions please?

[Dave-D]

Sorry I missed your post, kabelfrei / spirited.

The grids I use are:
http://www.titanwirelessonline.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=AT%2D30GR%2D58

Made by Poynting--available worldwide. Dave

[spirited]

agreed, any word on UBNt version or where this can be found on the market? +1 !

[SMART]

sorry i missed your post, kabelfrei / spirited.

The grids i use are:
http://www.titanwirelessonline.com/productdetails.asp?productcode=at%2d30gr%2d58

made by poynting--available worldwide. Dave

sorry but this antenna its not dual pol, how you used with rockets mike,???????????????????????????????

[Dave-D]

Sorry if I confused anybody.

Yes: these Poynting grids are single-polarity.
I haven't found any dual-polarity grids by any
maker; I'd love to find some.

I checked with Poynting SA, and they have no
current plans to make a dual-polarity grid.

If you want to use grids on a Rocket, currently
you'll need to use two, and isolate and orient
them. Definitely possible, not the easiest option. Dave

PS: SMART, this was not the antenna used by Mike;
he used some kind of dual-polarity panel for testing.

[popi78]

Hi UBNT experts!

I am new Ubiquiti member. I bought a pair of Bullet5.
I would like to link up 6.6km (4.1miles)
I have 2 pieces of 25dBi GRID antennas.
Theres is line of sight between the 2 places.
How much is the good excepted received signal??
These places are country environment.

Thank you your help.

[Dave-D]

Popi, this is actually a new thread.

But what you want to do sounds fine,
assuming you have a true line-of-sight
between the pounts. That means
clearance all around the center.

For that distance, you should expect
between -50 and -60dBi signal levels,
with the Bullet 3dB below max. rf output. Dave

[popi78]

Hi!
Thanks a lot.
First I should test it because the each side is top 70m tower.
Actually the FTP cable isn't there so I have to try it with accumulator.
- Does 24V the expected voltage for Bullet?
- Approximately how much can be the transfer rate in the link, if I have -60dBm received signal both side?

[Dave-D]

I'm assuming a Bullet M5; for -60dBm,
with the rf output set to 19dBm or below,
you should get maximum speed. Expect
over 30Mbps.

If you're using an accumulator for testing, be
sure to have a 1A fuse in the circuit. You only
need 12V at the radio. Because you have a long
(70m) cable, be sure to use a 24V PoE supply
for the final installation. Dave

[popi78]

Thanks! If 12V is enough, it is easier.
I have 24V Bias tee. I will use that.

When I get the result I will send a feedback to you.

(I should wait some days beacause the weather condition is not good now (snowing))

See you!!

[LPTech]

I am planing to attempt to deploy a production network as a WISP and I am curious about others PtMP networks, how many stations per square mile or km. Also how many users are on your networks, and what REAL throughput do you get. Thanks!

[popi78]

Dear Dave!

I am able to test the link nowdays, so I have an extra question:

I told you I should test it with accumulator first.

My question is right that I connect the +12V into the 4,5 pin together, and 0V into the 7,8pin together into the RJ45 connector??
I use 1A fuse!
http://site.gridconnect.com/docs/intercom/injectordiagram.jpg

Is it the right pinout for Ubiquiti too???

I don't want to kill them.

Thanks.

[netronix]

yes you can make it. It`s true form.

[WHT]

My question is right that I connect the +12V into the 4,5 pin together, and 0V into the 7,8pin together into the RJ45 connector??

Is it the right pinout for Ubiquiti too???
That is correct.

[WHT]

I am planing to attempt to deploy a production network as a WISP and I am curious about others PtMP networks, how many stations per square mile or km. Also how many users are on your networks, and what REAL throughput do you get.
You really can't say how many users per square mile. This is where lots of WISPs make a mistake.

1) A typical AP radio without polling or beam forming can support 30 to 35 actively connected users. With AirMax polling, you can get about 90 with the Bullet and 120 with the Rocket.

2) A WISP might put up a two hundred foot tower to reach out ten miles, or a three hundred square mile area. That could be hundreds, even tens of thousands of potential users...but no matter how many APs per that tower - even after you use VPOL and HPOL, 5 MHz channels, and sector antennas at different heights...there is no way you can support thousands of users. So now that WISP has basically wiped out all the channels for a ten mile radius.

3) So you have to estimate how many potential users, typically ten to twenty per cent of house count, that you might provide service for. If you have LOTS of potential users, you may want to consider 5.8 GHz with more channels or small one mile footprints.

[wireless_guy]

Hi Mike,

Using dual pol on a grid?? I don't understand this. Grids have only one direction of array(reflector) either you mount it vert or Horiz but not both at the same time because its a physical limitation. Is the two chain similar ( or maybe close) in levels??

Thanks

wireless_guy

[Dave-D]

Yes: dual-polarity phasing on a grid.
Made by more than one company.

If the grid is asymmetric, so are the
polarity gains. Dave

[WHT]

I haven't found any dual-polarity grids by any
maker; I'd love to find some.

Yes: dual-polarity phasing on a grid.
Made by more than one company.
I'm confused.

[InoX]

http://www.wifimarket.ro/detalii-produs-234-GRID_DISH_PARABOLIC_ANTENA_DUAL_POL.html

[WHT]

http://www.wifimarket.ro/detalii-produs-234-GRID_DISH_PARABOLIC_ANTENA_DUAL_POL.htmlIt don't take a rocket scientist to see the geometry of that grid's radiation pattern. I'm gonna say 28 dBi in one polarity and 24 dBi in the other. Hardly reciprocal gain in both polarities. FAIL.

[InoX]

it was just an example, I don't plan to use this antenna.

[WHT]

The word "ersatz" comes to mind.

[Dave-D]

WHT, what was the date on my post
you cited? Things change... Dave

[WHT]

Things change... DaveWhen I see a true reciprocal gain dual-polarity grid form factor antenna.

[marco52]

It don't take a rocket scientist to see the geometry of that grid's radiation pattern. I'm gonna say 28 dBi in one polarity and 24 dBi in the other. Hardly reciprocal gain in both polarities. FAIL.
Hi! I have to submit a question, make a video link to cover a distance of air equal to 5 km. which devices should I use?Thank you Gian Marco